KR 5670
Moderators: Ian Grace, Will Grace
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Highlander
- Posts: 489
- Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 12:52 am
Re: KR 5670
The Storrington Rally was a local (Worthing) Rally and we had friends in the area. In the early 50s there were many rallies all over the place. Our local one was Queen Elizabith's Hospital for Children and often over 100 cars would take part and 70 Motor cycles.. The film which made all old cars popular was the Brighton Run Film with Kenneth Moore (I've forgotten the title). Everyone started to wear deer storker hats and grew beards!!! Most students in the 50s ran old cars because they were very cheap (or seemed to be - £5 for a runner - a weeks wage) They were painted with bright valspar paint - yellow - red - green - the brighter the colour the better. All brass was polished. It was not until the 60s that we started to restore cars and bikes to there original contition and people got very stuffy about brass lamps and radiators and chrome plate (not nickel). Do you want any car rally plaques?? My pet hate is over restored cars with a polished board covered with rally plaques. So there!!! Highlander - Now 75 and two days.
Re: KR 5670
Alister,
I couldn't agree more. When I was at Bath University in the seventies, the use of pre-war cars as student hacks was coming to an end. There was a bright yellow Ruby in G car park and then there was my Morris 8 tourer - a real hack with Wolseley 10 ohv engine (MG TA?), and that was it. I bought the 8 from a teacher who had had it as a student in Bristol and he got it from a chap who worked for Bristol Aircraft - so it had many aircraft grade hoses, bolts, etc. in it. It had a Triumph TR3 exhaust and you could spin the wheels in the first two gears. I bought it for GBP 350. Different days.
And many happy returns, Alister.
I couldn't agree more. When I was at Bath University in the seventies, the use of pre-war cars as student hacks was coming to an end. There was a bright yellow Ruby in G car park and then there was my Morris 8 tourer - a real hack with Wolseley 10 ohv engine (MG TA?), and that was it. I bought the 8 from a teacher who had had it as a student in Bristol and he got it from a chap who worked for Bristol Aircraft - so it had many aircraft grade hoses, bolts, etc. in it. It had a Triumph TR3 exhaust and you could spin the wheels in the first two gears. I bought it for GBP 350. Different days.
And many happy returns, Alister.
Re: KR 5670
Yesterday I received the copy of the Brooklands Official Programme for the 1967 60th Anniversary celebration. The entry list reads like who's who of the VSCC and VCC, and sure enough, entry 426 was Mrs. O. Willats from Surrey in her (1929-sic) Morris Minor which was entered in the driving tests and concours. The only other Minor on the list was a 1931 tourer of G. E. H. Curtiss from Sussex. No mention of the saloon OU 8448 which we know Dave and Wendy Cooksey attended in. The only 1927 Humbers listed are those of R. Jones from Surrey and the 9/20 of M. Clark from Essex.
Also coming to light today is this letter from C. T. Kingerlee, Lord Nuffield's private secretary, to Olive Willats, dated 23rd April 1963:
Also coming to light today is this letter from C. T. Kingerlee, Lord Nuffield's private secretary, to Olive Willats, dated 23rd April 1963:
Re: KR 5670
KR 5670 was delivered to the shipping agent in Colnbrook yesterday. Seen here in the glamorous surroundings of Peterborough Services.
And in the Walker Freight warehouse.
And in the Walker Freight warehouse.
Re: KR 5670
Well, here's a thing. KR 5670 has no V5. I can't believe I overlooked this - probably because I happen to have a photocopy of the 1960's continuation logbook which Geoff Thornton gave me many years ago - so there was no need to go on to the DVLA website to discover the first registration date. The car has been delivered with the original logbook that this photocopy was taken from. I don't think anyone has sold the number - the car has sat with a disinterested owner since 1978 - so probably was never registered with DVLA.
So - before I ship the car to the US, I want to see if I can recover the number - first because it is part of the history of the car, and second, I may well position the car back in England when we retire so that we have a VSCC-eligible car in the UK for rallies, summer hols, etc.
I'll write to the DVLA to confirm that the number isn't on a BMW or similar, and if it is not, then I'll go through the procedure to recover the number - shouldn't be difficult as all the numbers match and I do have the continuation logbook, plus a photocopy of an early MoT.
I have never put a car through this process before - can someone advise me which forms, etc. I will need? Are they downloadable from DVLA? If the car needs to be inspected, it can be viewed in Colnbrook.
So - before I ship the car to the US, I want to see if I can recover the number - first because it is part of the history of the car, and second, I may well position the car back in England when we retire so that we have a VSCC-eligible car in the UK for rallies, summer hols, etc.
I'll write to the DVLA to confirm that the number isn't on a BMW or similar, and if it is not, then I'll go through the procedure to recover the number - shouldn't be difficult as all the numbers match and I do have the continuation logbook, plus a photocopy of an early MoT.
I have never put a car through this process before - can someone advise me which forms, etc. I will need? Are they downloadable from DVLA? If the car needs to be inspected, it can be viewed in Colnbrook.
Re: KR 5670
Here is Harry Edwards' response - and the process I shall follow:
"It is not a straightforward proceedure,presumably because so many people have "fiddled" the system to get registration numbers that they are not entitled to have.
As briefly as I can I'll explain the "765" system.
The owner claiming the return of a registration number has to be applying from a UK address.
You need the original old type "log book" which, of course, confirms the original chassis number and the registration number. This is generally the only document that actually ties the chassis number to the registration number
It is helpful,but not necessary,to have an old tax disc.
Any document you wish to submit must be the original,OR the DVLA will accept photocopies that have been copied by a DVLA office,but not by you or I. Such copies are then stamped by the DVLA office to say that they have seen the originals.
You require to obtain the application form "V765" from the DVLA.
You require to obtain a form "V55/5", this one either from the DVLA or from a post office that handles the issue of the "Road Tax" disc.
It is often helpful if you can supply a copy of the Production Record Certificate from Gaydon.
You are required to supply a current photograph of the vehicle as a "complete entity"(the DVLA wording).
Having filled in all the details/forms etc you then send the forms to the appropriate Club official who is designated by the DVLA. He or she then confirms the car model dating etc and signs the V765 form. In addition to that the owner of the car has to get someone ,who is not the owner or the Club official, to fill in an inspection form confirming such data as chassis/ model as correct to description Such inspection form is supplied by the Club official.
You send all the details/forms etc to the Club official designated by the DVLA to deal with cars covered by the club. In the case of all pre-war Morris models, except Bullnose and Flatnose models, you will find that I am designated as the person to deal with the pre-war Morris except as mentioned above. For Bullnose and Flatnose models (1913 to 1931) the Bullose Morris Club official handles the V765 requests.
"It is not a straightforward proceedure,presumably because so many people have "fiddled" the system to get registration numbers that they are not entitled to have.
As briefly as I can I'll explain the "765" system.
The owner claiming the return of a registration number has to be applying from a UK address.
You need the original old type "log book" which, of course, confirms the original chassis number and the registration number. This is generally the only document that actually ties the chassis number to the registration number
It is helpful,but not necessary,to have an old tax disc.
Any document you wish to submit must be the original,OR the DVLA will accept photocopies that have been copied by a DVLA office,but not by you or I. Such copies are then stamped by the DVLA office to say that they have seen the originals.
You require to obtain the application form "V765" from the DVLA.
You require to obtain a form "V55/5", this one either from the DVLA or from a post office that handles the issue of the "Road Tax" disc.
It is often helpful if you can supply a copy of the Production Record Certificate from Gaydon.
You are required to supply a current photograph of the vehicle as a "complete entity"(the DVLA wording).
Having filled in all the details/forms etc you then send the forms to the appropriate Club official who is designated by the DVLA. He or she then confirms the car model dating etc and signs the V765 form. In addition to that the owner of the car has to get someone ,who is not the owner or the Club official, to fill in an inspection form confirming such data as chassis/ model as correct to description Such inspection form is supplied by the Club official.
You send all the details/forms etc to the Club official designated by the DVLA to deal with cars covered by the club. In the case of all pre-war Morris models, except Bullnose and Flatnose models, you will find that I am designated as the person to deal with the pre-war Morris except as mentioned above. For Bullnose and Flatnose models (1913 to 1931) the Bullose Morris Club official handles the V765 requests.
Re: KR 5670
Good Luck Ian, sounds like you have it well in hand, and it shouldn;t be an issue assuming the number is still not in use....
I remember seeing another one of your vehicles in that same warehouse a couple of yrs back, when i took the Bedpan there!! Lets hope this one make it out of the country!!
One quick question..... any idea what the car in the background is in the warehouse.... a 50's peugeot perhaps...???
I remember seeing another one of your vehicles in that same warehouse a couple of yrs back, when i took the Bedpan there!! Lets hope this one make it out of the country!!
One quick question..... any idea what the car in the background is in the warehouse.... a 50's peugeot perhaps...???
Re: KR 5670
Yes, I was wondering what it was - and where it might be going. The owner of the outfit is a MMM man.
Re: KR 5670
Snippet just in from Kent records office, who tell me that this vehicle was first registered on 9th July 1930 to Capt R. Perry and sold by Arter & Co, Ramsgate. So is was not sold directly by Maltbys. Hmm....
Re: KR 5670
Photocopies are no good unless done by a vehicle registration office... I note your car featured in the morris register whats it worth feature this month! 
if it's got wheels or chips - it'll cost you dear
Re: KR 5670
Toby, I wasn't thinking about using this info to support my re-registration case - but thinking about it - it may help. I have no knowledge of the MR piece! Can you send me a copy? So what are they saying it is worth?!
Re: KR 5670
Hi Ian,
I have lent my copy out but I think it said 'Price paid £4750' from memory.
Clive
I have lent my copy out but I think it said 'Price paid £4750' from memory.
Clive
Re: KR 5670
Hi Clive,
That's interesting - I actually paid GBP 4,600. GBP 4,750 was the asking price. I await sight of the article with interest.
Incidentally, I got GBP 11k for the Bed-Pan - asking price was GBP 12k, but a gearbox issue came up and the new owner offered GBP 11k with the problem - which turned out to be damaged bearings due to oil loss in storage. This may be a record price for a Minor but still a very good deal for the buyer compared to what it cost me to restore it and considering the history surrounding this vehicle. Pleased to report that the gearbox is now sorted and the car is running well.
That's interesting - I actually paid GBP 4,600. GBP 4,750 was the asking price. I await sight of the article with interest.
Incidentally, I got GBP 11k for the Bed-Pan - asking price was GBP 12k, but a gearbox issue came up and the new owner offered GBP 11k with the problem - which turned out to be damaged bearings due to oil loss in storage. This may be a record price for a Minor but still a very good deal for the buyer compared to what it cost me to restore it and considering the history surrounding this vehicle. Pleased to report that the gearbox is now sorted and the car is running well.
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Highlander
- Posts: 489
- Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 12:52 am
Re: KR 5670
In todays Automobile there is a very good Obit for Anthony Mattinson. Quite a bit about the McEvoy Special and where it went - also on the same page an Obit for Lord Raglan Fitzroy - he built a Morris Special at Argic.College. Must be a record to have Morris mentioned twice on one page. a 1932 two seater for sale in Lancaster (NO 6145) I think we know of this Minor £9,000 Highlander.
Re: KR 5670
Alister,
I knew about Lord Raglan from the VSCC Bulletin, but not Tony. I don't think he will get an obit. in the Bulletin as he was staunchly anti-VSCC - on the basis that they would not grant eligibility to RC 300 - the McEvoy Minor prototype he was restoring. He eventually passed this car to Peter Plant last year, who is completing the protracted rebuild. I first met Tony about 15 years ago in Germany, where he ran his restoration business in the Black Forest and I was living in Darmstadt. I ended up with the original ash timbers from RC 300. Some years ago he semi-retired to Provence, but kept an interest in the restoration business. He had, for many years, been drafting a book on McEvoy, which he never published. It is to be hoped that the manuscript sees the light of day somehow. The last time we corresponded was when I acquired my McEvoy. His original plan for RC 300 was to fit a Zoller - he collected blown cars. Could you get me a copy of his Automobile obit? I'd like to put a piece in M 136. He will be missed. Thanks.
I knew about Lord Raglan from the VSCC Bulletin, but not Tony. I don't think he will get an obit. in the Bulletin as he was staunchly anti-VSCC - on the basis that they would not grant eligibility to RC 300 - the McEvoy Minor prototype he was restoring. He eventually passed this car to Peter Plant last year, who is completing the protracted rebuild. I first met Tony about 15 years ago in Germany, where he ran his restoration business in the Black Forest and I was living in Darmstadt. I ended up with the original ash timbers from RC 300. Some years ago he semi-retired to Provence, but kept an interest in the restoration business. He had, for many years, been drafting a book on McEvoy, which he never published. It is to be hoped that the manuscript sees the light of day somehow. The last time we corresponded was when I acquired my McEvoy. His original plan for RC 300 was to fit a Zoller - he collected blown cars. Could you get me a copy of his Automobile obit? I'd like to put a piece in M 136. He will be missed. Thanks.