VG 3260

[Ian Grace]

Hello Mike,

Great progress again. Do you have tyres yet? Or hub caps? Wheel nuts can be had from Mike Dowley of course.

I have re-lettered several panels - its a bit fiddly and the results depend very much on the panel being rust-free with clearly stamped lettering. It is simply a matter of getting a small pot of Humbrol enamel (I prefer ivory - not white - doesn't look so new). Then paint it over the letters and then lightly wipe it off with a cloth. If you end up with a slight smear over the surface, you can let it dry and then polish it off with a mild abrasive like Solvol. The same technique can be used for the lettering on the top ingnition advance/retard clamp, the slow running and mixture controls, and the Lucas lettering on the original horn push if you have it.

Here's the Bed-Pan's panel:

[mike houston]

Ian,
Thanks for the great picture, it gives me a standard to aim for. Although I have had the two smaller instruments checked over, the faces still have a certain 'patina', (they look old)!  How do your's look so new? Is it possible to get new faces for these guages? I will probably use your hints when I get round to lettering the panel. Incidentally the sonic cleaning has got the switchgear looking like new.

Regarding your questions. I haven't got tyres or tubes yet. I'm in a dilemma with tyres because there is a surprising choice. Whether to go the whole distance and get Dunlops or similar, or acknowledge that the car is unlikely to clock up much of a mileage and go for a cheaper (possibly sidecar?) tyre? Some feedback from knowledgeable parties is welcome! The little hubcaps seem to be a constant problem, and at the moment I have only one that I would feel comfortable about using, (and about six other mangled ones)! Again any suggestions would be welcome. I did see someone on a certain auction site offering plain dished caps for the early A7, made of a chromed plastic, which looked like they might fit and at a reasonable price. I had thought of looking for someone locally with a CNC setup, and get some costings done for new ones.

I'll send some more pics in when there is any further progress to report.

Regards to All, Mike.

[Highlander]

Mike, I think your tyres are 450 x 19 but I have just read on the orther Morris forum that some near new tyres are for sale :- 4 Dunlop Gold Seal 450 x 18 for £30 each plus rims if required A Peter Burrows on 17733363499. Highlander.

[Ian Grace]

There is some useful tyre sourcing data on the forum at http://www.vintageminor.co.uk/Forum1/ph ... ?f=6&t=680

[mike houston]

A quick update, then I have a few questions for the team! The panel lettering worked a treat thanks to Ian's advice of wiping over the painted letters with a soft cloth and a small amont of white spirit. However I am disappointed with the general pitted finish so am now thinking of stripping it all back and having another go! The wheels are away being powder coated, and I'm still looking for a solution to the perennial hub cap problem. Progress being made with the instruments. Now for the questions.

I've turned my attention to the gearbox. The oil ran from it nice and clear, no swarf or debris, and from what I can see everything is in good order so no need to open it up. However a couple of points. Firstly, the pedal cross shaft has some vertical movement within the pedal side bearing. The bronze bearing itself seems unworn, but as can be seen in the photo the shaft itself is grooved. Is this acceptable, and can anything be done about it? Secondly, the inside of the clutch cover did have some oil sitting in the bottom of it, and would I imagine drip in use. The gearbox input shaft again has some vertical movement. It is partially housed within a cover secured by four nuts. I imagine this contains some kind of seal? Should this be replaced as a matter of course and is it obtainable? I can see no mention of it in any of the usual reference books and manuals.

I look forward to your helpful comments,
Regards to all, Mike.

[Ian Grace]

Hi Mike,

As for the clutch shaft, I wouldn't worry about wear on the shaft too much - it will still operate perfectly well as a bit of side play in this shaft isn't going to cause a problem with de-clutching or brake operation. If you feel like it, though, you could have it welded and ground back to size. I have never done this myself, and I have never seen a shaft that isn't worn!

What is probably more important, and I have found several cars deficient, is that there should be a special washer over the end of the shaft and behind the split pin - to stop the brake pedal from wearing the split pin.

As for the gearbox, that cover secured by four bolts houses the input bearing and any side movement would indicate a worn bearing, which should be replaced. I'm not sure about the seal in there - anyone else had their gearbox apart lately? I am guessing that you should at least replace the bearing with a modern sealed type, but would be interested in other members' thoughts/advice.

As for the instrument panel - don't get too hung up on a bit of pitting - unless you are rebuilding the car to enter concours events - you really won't notice it that much at 50 mph on the way to the pub!

Keep up the good work and thanks for the update.

[Highlander]

Mike, Re your "male" groved shaft from the gear box - it is brand new!!! The one from my Minor and the two spare I had were very, very badly worn and I have the best one built up and machined (£75) and it still took me two days of fileing to make it a perfect fit with the female clutch plate. I agree with Ian re you instrument panel - with all the instruments in place and the switch and knobs in place and the panel in the dash board you will not notice any inperfections. If you are 6'3" like me you will not see the top half of the instrument panel anyway!!! Keep up the good work. Highlander.

[mike houston]

Another month has shot past, and a little more work has been done on the restoration despite the garage getting colder. Bit by bit I'm working on the saloon ash frame, gradually piecing the whole thing together. The screen and hinge pillars were farmed out to a joiner, they were beyond my capabilities, but every other piece is being tackled. None of it is finally screwed together, it is all loose fitted like a big puzzle. When I am finally happy with the fit of each section it will all be finalised! I guess I am fortunate in that I have been able to save a pattern for every piece, when one side has been completely rotted the other side has been OK. I have also been having to correct old repairs involving metal brackets and fibreglass around the rear and side windows in particular. I think I am very fortunate to have the cant rails intact as they provide the upper line for the whole shape. If they had rotted out I would have great problems. Sorry the pictures are not all that good, the garage is getting full of wood.

Regards to all, enjoy the Xmas shooping!!
Mike.

[Ian Grace]

Impressive work, Mike - you should be very pleased. Saloon frames are so much more tricky to sort than the open models.

[mike houston]

Ian,After a long winter's break I am slowly getting back to the garage, and as a break from woodwork have turned my attention to the cylinder head. Last Autumn I acquired a newly refurbished one from Quarry Engineering with the intention of transferring the cam mechanism across from old to new. Of course nothing is that simple, especially having thoroughly read your excellent guide to cylinder heads - M103. My first query concerns having this 'new' head skimmed further as QE voiced concerns about going down to 3.5", fearing breaking through a waterway. Incidentally this head is at 3.58" at present, the old head is at 3.61". Is 3.5" quite safe?Secondly, the rocker fingers seem to have only a little wear on both contact surfaces, but only two of them (5&8) have little oilway openings onto the valve top surface. (The photo might make this clearer).Is this normal? Does the finger profile look normal, (it looks like it has been redone)? Lastly I am considering the 12/12 cam. Presumably I will then need to upgrade the springs? Are there any other mods worth making? Is it for instance really desirable to put in the longer shafts and then have to put in a new support for them?  Regards to all, Mike.

[Ian Grace]

Hi Mike,

You can safely skim your head to M type compression of 5.5:1. and I would definitely recommend this - particularly if you are contemplating a 12/12 cam. It is very simple to do - skim so that the head is exactly 3.5" thick and you have standard M compression - and there is no risk of going thru to the waterways. The difference in performance is very noticeable and makes a Minor much more practical on the road - particularly for a saloon.

By the way, you can take an additional 3/32" off to give 6.2 compression ratio - also without risk of braking in to the water!

Re other mods, stronger valve springs are probably not worth it - they just delay valve bounce at revs higher than you will probably want to go! Double springs can be useful - only because if you break a spring, you don't end up dropping the valve. I fitted the longer rocker shaft rods on the Bed-Pan with the associated bronze rear carrier as I have seen the back end of the shaft break - this happened to Robin Harcourt-Smith last year on his CMS. Incidentally, you will probably have to grind a tad off the base of the bronze carrier so it fits inside the tin cam cover.

Other than that, the only other mod is the neoprene vertical drive pinion seal - seal and adaptor plate available from Mike Dowley.

Hope this helps,

Ian

[mike houston]

Needless to say I have hit some snags in the area of the vertical drive. This appears to have been the subject of some modification, probably before it was laid up. I was expecting to find an outer sleeve with the Torrington or Hyatt bearings within, but instead found a solid phosphor bronze(?) bush with a modern type oil seal below it flush with the top surface, see pictures. Then within the drain housing is the oil seal housing with a degraded cork seal. Incidentally in the picture the bush may appear to have a sleeve, but it is a machining mark, it is solid!
The question is whether to retain this arrangement? There is no discernible play whatsoever of the shaft within the bush, so I am inclined to go with it, especially as the modern oil seal also shows no sign of wear. I intend replacing the lower oil seal housing with a new one incorporating a new neoprene seal . Has anyone got any other thoughts on this arrangement?
The only other concern is that the drain housing casting has had a break in the past and been repaired with chemical metal or something similar, see picture. Does anyone out there have a good housing I could obtain for a consideration?
I look forward to replies,
Regards to all, Mike.

[Ian Grace]

Hi Mike,

Thanks interesting photos and information. I had an OHC Minor once that had a solid bronze bush in place of the Torrington bearings like yours, and it worked fine. You just need to make sure it has a (small!) oil groove cut in it for lubrication. If yours has no wear - I'd stick with it.

As for the neoprene seal mod, I would do that, and I'd definitely replace the cracked/repaired drain housing. Sorry, I don't have a spare myself, but they are not impossible to find.

[DF9053]

Hi Mike,

I totally agree with Ian, keep the bronze bush and the moder oil seal, they work very well. I have this set up in the M type and it has not shed a drop of oil.

cheers
Jeremy

[Ken Martin]

Hello Mike
I regret that I am late into this correspondence. I agree – stick with the plain bearing if it looks OK. My car also had a bronze bush bearing fitted when I got the car – I think it was a common fix for these engines. It had a spiral oil groove cut in it. I eventually discovered Torrington bearings and have used 3 or 4 sets over the years. Interestingly the supplier of these – Mike Dowley (Sports and Vintage Motors) and evidently many of the competing MG people - still use Hyatt bearings as these run easier. The trouble is they wear the shaft out and so both bearings and pinion shaft and gears have to be replaced when the Hyatt’s are worn out. When I changed to Torringtons many years ago, Mike Dowley was able to get my original shaft built up and reground back to standard.
My car has never had a modern seal in the vertical drive assembly. The trick is to enlarge the groove cut in the base unit under the bearing and ensure that there is a seal between the oil thrower disc and the top of the yoke.
It is worth checking the back n/s hole for the head stud as the water jacket here is formed by a steel tube. These corrode and fail allowing water to enter the hole and submerge the stud. A washer and seal must be put under the nut otherwise water will surely get up past the nut on top of the head and into the oil. Otherwise replace the tube.
Incidentally I disagree with Ian’s advice to take metal off the head to improve the performance!