"All the old cars which are worth saving have already been saved and restored - what is left is the rubbish. Discuss."
This was a remark made to me by a (thankfully) ex-member the other night. He was fiercely anti-VSCC, equally fiercely pro-Bullnose Morris Club, fiercely damning of any Morris of the thirties, and when I explained the Early Morris Society to him, he got so aggressive on the 'phone that I eventually gave up trying to reason with him and threw the 'phone down on him! I don't think he realised that we won the war so that we can live in a free world and anyone has a right to set up their stall and offer their wares. It's called a free market economy, and it thrives on competition, not regulation or oppression.
There is a grain of truth in his statement. If you look at - for example - 18/80 MGs, you will find that most have now been found and restored - and restored to a very high standard, becuase they are worth the money invested in the restoration. On the other hand, there are droves of SV Minors rotting slowly - their owners (and I am generalising here!) have no real impetus to spend money on them and put them back on the road. That is a trend we are trying to overcome in the VMR, before they all get beyond restoration.
Pick up your pencils now, and you may write on both sides of the paper!
Oh Lordy, I thought these sort of idiots had left the movement years ago.
WHEN will they realise that there were good and bad cars (in all price brackets) built in all decades. I can name some quite dreadful expensive 1920's cars and some very good cheap 1930's saloons.
As you say Ian, it is (or perhaps was) a free country, if somebody wants to spend time restoring anything from a 60 hp Napier to a 1926 Atco Mower then that is surely to be welcomed....and a damm sight better than sitting watching the box every night. Who the hell do these people think they are ? In any case, we should do well to remember that it was invariably the lesser cars that did the hardest work, it was the Ford 8's and Austin Rubies that took the children to the seaside, did the shopping, got flogged without mercy throughout the war..and still came back for more. I well remember talking to a respected fighter pilot from the last war years ago about this very subject and the fond thought that they all drove red MG's.....total rot he said...some did, it was true but most had very ordinary cars...his was an Austin Ten Lichfield and the Station Commander had a Twenty Oxford !
There, that feels better !!
Think Faberge Eggs! Perceived to be very high quality articles. A known number manufactured by 'known' craftsmen over a specific period. Expensive when new and affordable only by the very wealthy. Prices at auction today are sky high and affordable only by the extremely wealthy. Kept in strong rooms, vaults and safes and only brought out to be 'shown off' and admired by close friends and family. Oh, there are some that are kept in museums and these can be viewed by the likes of you or me, as long as we pay our admission money.
Now compare the Faberge Egg situation to specific marques of pre war car. e.g. Bugatti, Lagonda, Aston Martin, Alfa, Rolls Royce, Bentley and many others. These items have a similar scarcity value. They were originally manufactured by highly skilled craftsmen and were priced accordingly. Styling evolved slowly and was less likely to be affected by 'fashion'. Today’s auction prices indicate that only a very small percentage of the population could afford to purchase one. Many of these cars are now being sought by collectors for their private museums and financial investors to keep in air conditioned garages to ensure their 'asset' does not deteriorate. Fewer of these cars are now seen at events, and when the present custodians of those vehicles that still do 'come out to play' eventually decide to part with them - where are they most likely to end up? Oh, and some are in public museums, where we can go and look at them and we may be lucky enough to hear the engine running, if the curator deems it necessary.
Now specifically think mass market pre war cars. Manufactured in their tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands in the cases of Austin Sevens and Morris Eights) Brought motoring to the 'lower middle class', teachers, junior officers in the services, middle management in industry etc. Vehicles subject to frequent ‘fashion’ changes. Plenty of most types still around and many to be had cheaply as restorable projects. Kept in lock ups, sheds and gardens! Prices of VSCC eligible cars rising faster than the 'rest' - although most' good' examples of all historics are rising above inflation. (Check eBay, The Automobile, Prewarcar.com etc) These (VSCC) cars are considered 'more desirable', certainly more bid for them and more importantly, more sell on eBay than non VSCC eligible cars.
Conclusion - Market forces dictate prices. No surprise here then. What creates market forces? Availability and then mostly intangibles, such as desirability, perceived quality, perceived asset growth potential etc. So what is the answer to the question “All the old cars worth saving have already been saved and restored – what are left are rubbish”. I guess the answer is ‘Incorrect’. The reality is that there are bound to be other ‘finds’ of cars that are generally viewed as being from the quality manufacturers. Most will face the prospect of an expensive restoration and then very long periods of inactivity. Fewer cars in this category are likely to compete or take part in events in the years to come.
There are many other cars from the same period, which the proposition cites as rubbish, which will become more desirable as time passes. Fewer and fewer quality vehicles coming onto the market will ensure that vehicles from lower down the quality tier will in turn become “an old car worth saving”. Our cars may be close to the bottom of that pre war ladder, but values will go up, until at some point in the future we will get the first £10,000 Minor. To us, the owners of these cars, the Minor is already a quality vehicle and worth saving – the conundrum is do we keep this secret to ourselves or do we tell everybody else what a great little car the Minor is?
Nothing has an intrinsic value. Price is only determined by a willing buyer and willing seller. Without resorting to too many cliches beauty is in the eye of the beholder and honestly to my eye there are prettier cars than the Morris minor.
As a WW2 baby I have a nostalgia for the period and of course the cars of the 30s and 40s as I suspect do many others. There is also the boys toys syndrome where we fulfill childhod dreams at a later age as funds become available.
Some people are 'Rescuers'. I rescued a lovely Georgian building Grade 2 listed and the former home of John Cotman and was not a good investment for many years. Also my house which when we purchased it had a demolition order on it and no water or electricity connected was a rescue. I hope NG 850 will appreciated being rescued one day and my second book (basically a self rescue development book) is due out in April so maybe I have a lost cause thing. However, hands up all those who are rescuers!!
What we in the VMR are not ,however, are SNOBS and that is up to them but I am not wasting time attempting to rescue them. Stay cool Ian why get angry with people who don't have your vision?
This is all good stuff, Budhists will tell you that material goods are impermanent and people attatch too much importance to them. If we strip it right down, it follows that nothing is of importance and if I give away all my possessions or bury my cars or give up eating then the world will still go on. I know people who are obsessed with designer goods or modern cars and think they will be unhappy with out them. Despite all this I enjoy old nostalgic things yet am realising that a great number of models of cars have been saved and that there are very poor examples that may now be better used for parts to keep others on the road. In a lot of cases it is economical madness for the average person to save them. A cars worth is dictated by what someone else will pay for it at any given time and how many are available on the market, so financial value can be vague at times-compare the 1980s value of E types to the current time, fuel guzzlers are dearer to run now. Good unrestored projects are still about but there are many projects that have had some preservation done in the last 40 years. What makes a car worth saving? If it is rarity then maybe there aren't many left to save, a friend has just sold an early Renault 17 coupe for restoration and then the buyer told him it's the only one of 500 made, known to survive - rare? worth saving? at any cost to the restorer? My brother has a very sound Morris 10/4, an excellent project but there are lots surviving and the value when restored justifies little expenditure for a married man with a family - worth saving? I guess all the rare pre war cars have probably been saved but the massive volume post wars (60's on) are becoming very rare due to low values, higher restoration costs and scarcity, but are still there to be found and saved as part of our motoring heritage. Anyway, a mans gotta have a hobby!!!
