JF 4238 1933 Minor Saloon

[DF9053]

You can get DKH's that run the other way. However as a test wire the balance weights up so they can't move, this will stop any unwanted ignition timing issues and stop any noise from the weights.

cheers
Jeremy

[Jpallis001]

Thanks Jeremy - I have just collected a DK4A that looks to rotate in the correct direction - was new old stock but seized, so manged to bend the top plate a little! one step forward + two back! - a job for tomorrow night

distributor 4.jpg (69.04 KiB) Viewed 2086 times

Re: tappet clearances - looks like they should be 4Thou HOT - what is that likely to be cold? (have got everything in bits - would need to reassembly to warm it up!) -- that should quieten it down a bit-- http://prewarminor.freeforums.org/post3 ... ance#p3738

Re: couplings - I will load chassis with 4 cwt and see what they look like

[Jpallis001]

Apologies for cross-posting but my brain hurts and the battery is flat – SV engine expert required.

When I had set the tappets at 19 Thou the engine ran but there was a lot of tappet noise. When the Tappets were set at 5 Thou the engine did not run. The engine was very easy to turn over, very little compression. I used the ‘Rule of nine’ method to set the Tappets (8 open – set 1; 6 open set 3 etc)

I rotated the engine and followed the valve sequence, one cylinder at a time; exhaust open -> exhaust closed-> inlet open -> inlet closed. I checked the tappet clearances at this stage; expecting to find the valves closed, ready for ignition. They were not; and there was no ‘clearance’ at the tappets. I was expecting to find 4 Thou clearance at this stage?

What is this trying to telling me?
If I follow this sequence through, and set the Tappets (to 4 Thou) at the point when I think they are ‘rocking’ {closed}, just prior to ignition, should the engine run?

[Ian Grace]

John,

All sounds very strange. Lack of compression/not running would seem to indicate valves not closing properly, but I'm not sure why they aren't.

My first Minor was a '32 SV and I went through a very similar sort of exercise to the one you are going through. The engine wouldn't run so I checked the tappets. I found that the tappet gap increased linearly from valve 1 to valve 8, which I thought was strange. I then found that if I pushed down on tappet number 8, it was spongy! After much head scratching and investigation, the reason became horribly clear. The rollers from the rear camshaft roller bearing were in the sump and the cam was hanging on the front bearing only!

Unfortunately, unlike the OHC engine, you can't actually see the cam, unless you have the sump off, have a neck like a giraffe and the eyes of a cat. But then setting up the OHC cam is a hobby all of its own!

[Jpallis001]

Ian - What I am really struggling to understand is why, when an individual tappet gap is set at 4 Thou following the 'rule of nine' sequence, that gap is not 4 Thou when both of the valves for a particular cylinder are closed? Same cam; same rotational position; same bearings (all new). I am confident that the timing chain is correctly fitted + cogs aligned on marks. Unless I find inspiration tonight I will set Tappets back to 19 Thou and see what happens.

[Ian Grace]

If the head is not off, it might be worth whipping it off so you can see which valves are open and which are closed. Then you would be certain you were getting the tappet clearances set at the right point when the tappet is on the heel of the cam.

[Jpallis001]

I worked through the 1342 order; followed the valve sequence and set the Tappets for each cylinder, in turn, at 4 Thou - that brought the compressions back but unfortunately by then the battery had had enough. As I was also in the process of fitting the new distributor and had not correctly re-timed the engine, I decided to wait for another day + a few volts! Will attempt to time + start as is, in the morning with 19 Thou and head off as the back-up plan.

[Ian Grace]

Good luck John. Let us know how you get on.

Ian

[Jpallis001]

Thanks Ian - with a recharged battery, it started first time this morning - perhaps a little less Tappet/Clatter noise than with 19Thou gap - still unable to understand how 4 Thou set using 'Rule of Nine' does not result in 4 Thou clearance when checked using the 'valves rocking' technique? If I get bored sometime I might have a look an see what clearance I now have when checked in 'rule of nine' sequence.

I need to find, and listen to, another SV engine that is running properly before I take anything else to bits - anyone in the North East/Penines? - I will forget about the engine + work on the body for a while

John

[Jpallis001]

Well, it might be that the 'clatter' that I was trying to get rid of was a characteristic of the engine? Tracking back through a PWM thread + my recent request there does seem to be a lot of confusion over Tappet Clearances. The books/mauals look to contradict each other and several folks report loss of power etc when they tried to reduce the gap. You will see Mike's extract from Harry Edwards INFORMATION MANUAL (had better try to find a copy)

. "not less than 4thou for engines up to 20712. Engines 20713 to 31750 (1932-3) 19-23thou clearance. Engines 31751 on (4 speed models) 4thou".

[Jpallis001]

Decided to leave the engine alone for a while to concentrate on the body, it might mend itself!, or it might not even be 'broken' - just naturaly noisey. Does anyone have any photos that show how the door overlaps work? I can see that the rear of the door overlaps the rear quarter panel and that the front of the door hinges inside of the front door pillar?

What happens at the top?

John

[Jpallis001]

The sun shone again, so I removed the remaining bits of the roof. Will start to construct the sliding roof tomorrow. Is anyone able to give me the dimensions of the 'opening' in the roof (the open rectangle that the sliding componet covers) that an original sliding roof has?

Roof Removed.jpg (66.31 KiB) Viewed 1888 times

I am also looking around to see if rear wings are obtainable - does anyone know if the wings on a 1933 tourer and saloon are the same? are the wings 'handed'

[Ian Grace]

Tourer and saloon wings are the same, and they are not handed - except once they have been drilled to fit! The only handed rear wings are those of the Semi-sports and the LWB cars which have the inner fillet at the back.

[Jpallis001]

And nearly sorted out the roof structure -lots of Ash + lots of Screws; probably raised the centre of gravity a bit! - might it tip over when cornering?(hard)

roof structure 1a.jpg (96.53 KiB) Viewed 1831 times

roof structure 2a.jpg (80.24 KiB) Viewed 1832 times

Just need to sort out how to marry the incline from the sunroof aperture to the rear roof profile.

Roof Rear Profile A.jpg (80.98 KiB) Viewed 1831 times

[Ian Grace]

And nearly sorted out the roof structure -lots of Ash + lots of Screws; probably raised the centre of gravity a bit! - might it tip over when cornering?(hard)

Like at Prescott?